What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solution?

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What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solution?

Postby Ryan99 on August 14th, 2011, 12:06 am 

Why or why arn'nt there effects?
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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby BioWizard on August 14th, 2011, 9:00 am 

There isn't an effect because ions in solution usually have all paired electrons in their atomic orbitals (in fact, that's why they ionize in the first place), and thus are not paramagnetic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paramagnetism
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diamagnetism
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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby Johnny_Pencilface on September 20th, 2011, 11:12 am 

But a magnetic field must have an effect on ions. Think about mass spectrometry. The magnetic field deflects ions more with a greater charge:mass ratio. I think the point is that the net displacement of ions is nil in a stationary beaker of a solution of a salt, for example. Or that the effects are negligible and undetectable.
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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby BioWizard on September 20th, 2011, 11:42 am 

Johnny_Pencilface wrote:But a magnetic field must have an effect on ions. Think about mass spectrometry. The magnetic field deflects ions more with a greater charge:mass ratio. I think the point is that the net displacement of ions is nil in a stationary beaker of a solution of a salt, for example. Or that the effects are negligible and undetectable.


You might be talking about a different phenomenon here. Magnetic fields deflect ions IF they are moving through the field. That's why in mass spectrometry, the ions are accelerated to high speeds before they enter the magnetic field. The precession effect is, at the level of the atom, independent of the motion of that atom, and only occurs if the particle is paramagnetic.
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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby Greek_Geek on September 20th, 2011, 10:48 pm 

BioWizard wrote:You might be talking about a different phenomenon here. Magnetic fields deflect ions IF they are moving through the field. That's why in mass spectrometry, the ions are accelerated to high speeds before they enter the magnetic field. The precession effect is, at the level of the atom, independent of the motion of that atom, and only occurs if the particle is paramagnetic.


I think you are correct. The effect of a magnetic field on a charged particle is F = qv x B, so the ion has to be in motion to feel a force. So ignoring any paramagnatism, ions in solution aren't moving fast enough, or in any uniform direction, to feel the effects of a field.
Last edited by BioWizard on September 20th, 2011, 11:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Fixed quotes
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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby BioWizard on September 20th, 2011, 11:50 pm 

Greek_Geek wrote:ions in solution aren't moving fast enough, or in any uniform direction, to feel the effects of a field.


Bingo.
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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby Greek_Geek on September 21st, 2011, 2:53 am 

Well shut my mouth!

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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby BioWizard on September 21st, 2011, 8:07 am 

See, you need the current to create directional ion motion before the magnetic field can have an effect. Very cool video!
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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby Johnny_Pencilface on September 23rd, 2011, 7:25 am 

Thanks for clearing that up, guys.
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Re: What effects, if any, do magnets have on ions in a solut

Postby Shild on September 5th, 2016, 6:10 am 

How about if ions were flowing in a pipe through a magnetic field? For example the divertor coolant pipes of a tokamak where flow ~10 m/s and magnetic field > 6 Tesla?
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Ion Sorter

Postby Faradave on September 5th, 2016, 11:25 am 

Shild wrote:How about if ions were flowing in a pipe through a magnetic field?

A physical fluid current serves just as well as an electric current (of the ions). As ions in the fluid flow past the magnetic field, positive ions will tend to deflect in one direction, while negative ions deflect oppositely. The more rapid the flow, or the magnetic field strength, the greater the deflection force.
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